DUST Search - Was it AR or gal assault?

Adipem Nothi wrote:

Vesta Opalus wrote:

Adipem Nothi wrote:

Georgia Xavier wrote:

Adipem Nothi wrote:

Another interesting experiment might involve knocking armor down a notch (or two) then seeing what shakes out in the meta.

What I think will happen is a mass respec to cal and min suits with mostly laser weaponry being used

Yeah, you might be right. Did bump into quite a few dual-tanked CalAssaults last night. Not sure how they'd address dual tanking without over-penalizing one side or the other.

Maybe CCP could get off their asses and add global diminishing returns on all HP modules

Cant even stack 3 damage mods before it starts getting worthless, why should people be able to stack 8 HP modules with full effect?

Makes sense. Might have to tone down damage output if maintaining current (or near current) TTK levels is a priority. Maybe a flat % reduction across the board? Alternatively, Cat Merc proposed decreasing HP module yield and increasing base HP levels for each frame. This would effectively decrease the relative benefit of HP modules ... seems like that could work as well.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.15 16:05:00 - [1] - Quote shaman oga wrote: The one in need of a buff? I'm asking because the gal ass was fine even before the last hotfix, what wasn't fine was the AR and its variants. So, why has the gal bonus been buffed instead of buffing the AR? I think it's a good thing that assault have a bonus to make weapons perform better with them, but this change has not fixed the AR with all the other suits. IMO it would be better to have a slight ROF increase for AR (and variants) and then nerf a little gal ass ROF bonus, in this way the combo AR + gal ass would work like it's now, but AR would be more viable for other suits too. I would also apply gal ass bonus to all gal tech weapons and not only to AR. But the Gal Ass wasnt fine, it was inferior to the minmatar for mobility fits and inferior to the amarr assaults in almost every way except for a very small advantage in rep speed and move speed. I think the ARs were underperforming (except the tactical, which was just being overshadowed by the scrambler), so they may need a bit of buffing, but adding this weapon bonus to the gallente assault will let them experimenting while preventing ARs from becoming FOTM across the board, which is good. Not sure if they did the bonus with this intent, but whatever.
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.15 16:50:00 - [2] - Quote shaman oga wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: But the Gal Ass wasnt fine, it was inferior to the minmatar for mobility fits and inferior to the amarr assaults in almost every way except for a very small advantage in rep speed and move speed. In fact nobody was using gal ass + ARR Sure they were, but people use crappy suits all the time. It doesnt matter, the amarr was objectively better unless you honestly think ~.3 speed and a few reps is better than 40 health or so, a ton more stamina and stamina regen, and a massive heat bonus to the best rifle in the game. Edit to add: this does not include the Rattati's Officer suit, which is beast mode, but at proto level the Amarr assault is clearly better.
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.15 17:40:00 - [3] - Quote Georgia Xavier wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: shaman oga wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: But the Gal Ass wasnt fine, it was inferior to the minmatar for mobility fits and inferior to the amarr assaults in almost every way except for a very small advantage in rep speed and move speed. In fact nobody was using gal ass + ARR Sure they were, but people use crappy suits all the time. It doesnt matter, the amarr was objectively better unless you honestly think ~.3 speed and a few reps is better than 40 health or so, a ton more stamina and stamina regen, and a massive heat bonus to the best rifle in the game. Edit to add: this does not include the Rattati's Officer suit, which is beast mode, but at proto level the Amarr assault is clearly better. You forgot that amarr assaults look better than gal assaults
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.15 20:00:00 - [4] - Quote shaman oga wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: Sure they were, but people use crappy suits all the time. It doesnt matter, the amarr was objectively better unless you honestly think ~.3 speed and a few reps is better than 40 health or so, a ton more stamina and stamina regen, and a massive heat bonus to the best rifle in the game. Edit to add: this does not include the Rattati's Officer suit, which is beast mode, but at proto level the Amarr assault is clearly better. People had only 0.3 bonus speed over amarr because they tank gal suits, tanking high HP on gal suit is like armor tanking caldari suits or tanking heavily a min suit, you are going out of your role. No, the .3 bonus speed is the default sprint speed difference without plates or kincats, and a .2 bonus speed for non-sprint. And talking fitting variation is largely pointless since they have the exact same slot layout and the Amarr has higher PG, which is the limiting fitting factor for both suits in the vast majority of their fits. Whatever the Gallente can do the Amarr can do better (again with the exception of a tiny repair bonus and a tiny speed differential).
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.16 15:11:00 - [5] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Georgia Xavier wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Another interesting experiment might involve knocking armor down a notch (or two) then seeing what shakes out in the meta. What I think will happen is a mass respec to cal and min suits with mostly laser weaponry being used Yeah, you might be right. Did bump into quite a few dual-tanked CalAssaults last night. Not sure how they'd address dual tanking without over-penalizing one side or the other. Maybe CCP could get off their asses and add global diminishing returns on all HP modules Cant even stack 3 damage mods before it starts getting worthless, why should people be able to stack 8 HP modules with full effect?
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.16 17:39:00 - [6] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Vesta Opalus wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Georgia Xavier wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Another interesting experiment might involve knocking armor down a notch (or two) then seeing what shakes out in the meta. What I think will happen is a mass respec to cal and min suits with mostly laser weaponry being used Yeah, you might be right. Did bump into quite a few dual-tanked CalAssaults last night. Not sure how they'd address dual tanking without over-penalizing one side or the other. Maybe CCP could get off their asses and add global diminishing returns on all HP modules Cant even stack 3 damage mods before it starts getting worthless, why should people be able to stack 8 HP modules with full effect? Makes sense. Might have to tone down damage output if maintaining current (or near current) TTK levels is a priority. Maybe a flat % reduction across the board? Alternatively, Cat Merc proposed decreasing HP module yield and increasing base HP levels for each frame. This would effectively decrease the relative benefit of HP modules ... seems like that could work as well. Toning down damage Im not sure is needed, if you see an Amarr with ~4 hp armor modules you are looking at a pretty hefty TTK already, and stacking more modules just makes the TTK egregiously long. Also not sure about decreasing HP on HP modules, since other modules are already debatably nearly as useful (situationally far more useful). Its basically about preventing dual tank brick stacking, which is just an obnoxious way to fit and boring as **** to fight against or with (my opinion, obviously) and encourages the kind of amarr scrambler rifle mentality of just bulling your way into whatever you are up against, because you know that even if a shotgunner ambushes you, you can turn around and melt them in half a second regardless before they can burn through your tank.
Vesta Opalus PROJECT OF KILLERS. RUST415 1	Posted - 2015.10.16 18:48:00 - [7] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Agreed, Vesta. Any ideas on the specific "how to" ? First blush I would just set stacking penalties to start light on your fourth HP module and ramp up to make the 6th module never worth fitting (So starting out around 10% on your fourth module ramping up rapidly to up to ~50% maybe on the sixth module). I dont have a problem with someone sticking a shield extender on top of their 3 armor modules (or even 4 armor modules), etc. Its just the 100% brick tanking that should die in a fire. This kind of change wouldnt affect commandos/sentinels that much since they only have 5 module slots, which is great because stacking health is a perfectly legitimate thing for them to do: but it would place some disincentives on scouts, logis and assaults who might do this kind of **, which I think is exactly what we should be aiming this at. Honestly this is kind of a fringe concern though, since you rarely see brick tanked suits these days, its just annoying that HP modules have no diminishing return, and bricked suits are basically someone saying "** effectiveness and usefulness, Im going to win the first firefight with you unless you spend 30 seconds to a minute picking me apart". Frankly I'd rather see CCP put the effort this would take into fixing framerate issues or something.